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DRAFTING!!!! nb stuff plz read kae :>
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DRAFTING!!!! nb stuff plz read kae :>
Drafting is an integral part of competitive DotA and can be decisive in the outcome of a match. Take MYM recently for example; they seem to be going through a weak patch. Maelk has confessed this is to do with drafting, showing clearly how important drafting can be.
Drafting (past+present)
Drafting in 6.48b differs hugely from drafting now in 6.52e not only has the amount of bans changed, but also popular picks have changed and high tier heroes have changed. I will outline what are now (in my opinion) high tier and above heroes of 6.52e. (they aren't in any order for the moment)
Low tier heroes can still be used but are generally seen to be a weak pick in comparison to other heroes, these heroes generally have spells of little use to a team. For example bloodseeker is a weak pick as his ulti is easy to nullify, strygwyrs thirst is easily countered if you simply keep an eye on your hp etc.
Mid to high tier heroes is a really massive pool in this version, many old high tier heroes have moved down (Sandking, Leshrac etc.) and many new heroes have been discovered or rediscovered i should say such as Broodmother, juggernaut. Generally speaking they require a specific lineup/lane to be effective, if they are picked in correct situations they can be unstoppable.
High tier heroes are heroes that are generally thought to be "imba" or better than most other heroes, these are heroes that can normally adapt to a variety of different strategies/lineups and are regularly banned. Which brings me to my next subject.
Banning
Banning heroes is fairly simple and straight forward task. When you ban heroes, you want to have at least a rough idea of heroes you want picking in your mind and counters to them. You also want to stop the opponents from getting as many high tier heroes as possible.
This means that when you're sentinel (or first-picking) you want to ban a lot of high tier heroes ideally stopping your opponents from picking highest tier heroes on their 1st two picks, this can be achieved by simply banning high tier heroes OR if it is obvious from the bans what kind of strat your opponents are going for, ban heroes that are fundamental for the lineup they desire.
For example, if your opponents ban several gankers/strong early game heroes lets say Chen, BM, NA it may become clear that they are after a jungling hero that is strong late game. So you could ban Terrorblade. (Note: there is always a likely chance that it could simply be a coincidence that they are banning these heroes, but Terrorblade is a high tier hero anyway so its a win win situation if they are going for a strat revolving around him/strong late game hero.
When you're banning for scourge (or picking second), its generally a good idea to leave 3 top tier heroes unbanned, this way you're guaranteed to get 2 decent heroes which not only puts you at an advantage, but puts the opposing team at a disadvantage and gives them a smaller scope of heroes to work with.
For example, if the current bans are -wl, -na, -bm, -lich, -tb, -zeus, -qop I'd recommend banning a decent hero but not a top tier hero/a hero that you don't want to be first or second picking (e.g Magnus) this means that if the enemy pick say PotM, you are still left with puck es (or whatever heroes you're after).
Banning for specific lineups/heroes
Specific lineups are countered in a variety of ways generally speaking.
1. Gank > carry (Early/mid)
2. Push > carry (Early/mid)
3. Carry > all (Late)
Other than the above, generally it's specific heroes that counter strats/other groups of heroes. Here are two examples:
Example 1:
Pugna's Nether Ward - Wards > nukes. This should be taken account when banning/picking.
Example 2:
If you're aiming to jungle with TB, BM is a 100% must to ban, Chen also due to his overwhelming force early game . Hence, banning for Junglers - BM/Chen > TB. This is easy when it comes to high tier heroes, you can ban a high tier hero that would counter your strategy without revealing your desired heroes.
So what do you do when it is a lower tier hero that counters your lineup/hero. Say for whatever reason you want to go for Lich, Lesh, Lina, etc. the obvious counter to these is Pugna, but Pugna isn't really a ban-worthy hero. So my advice is this: Under these circumstances, I would either leave the hero unbanned in which case you have to pick subtlely, or ban the hero on your last pick this means the enemy have no bans (or only 1) to react to this ban in either case you should be safe and be allowed to at least pick the majority of your desired heroes.
Picking
The picking part of drafting in my eyes is a tad more complex. Not only are there more heroes involved, but reading your opponents picks is essential as counter picking is vital to a good draft, its easier to loose track of picks and mess things up.
Although the fundamentals of picking are pretty easy to grasp, when picking you need to maintain a balance of counter-picking and picking heroes you desire. If you can do this and work them into a lineup then you're well on your way to being OK at drafting, its quite hard for me to actually convey how this is done without using some drafts as examples so i will take the drafts from my next few clan wars and post them here with annotations.
When picking your first 1 or 2 heroes (if you're second picking) be sure that you have a mental note of the full ban list or even better have someone who isn't drafting write them down as you go along if you let the opposition have too many heroes they want by forgetting the bans you're screwed. If you have no specific lineup in mind it goes a little something like this for your three turns of picking:
When picking first:
Turn 1: 1st - god tier heroes
Turn 2: 2nd/3rd - mid/high tier heroes
Turn 3: 4th/5th - whatever makes lanes from your current heroes/create synergies.
When picking second:
Turn 1: 1st/2nd - god tier/high tier
Turn 2: 3rd/4th - Mid/high, Lanes/Synergies
Turn 3: 5th - Lanes/Synergies
When picking a specific lineup you must include at least some high tier heroes or else the opposing team will get too many high/god tier heroes then you may aswell ff. But generally it goes something like this.
Don't forget when picking that even high tier heroes are circumstantial and you can end up with a crappy lineup with a few high tiers, make sure that your heroes also work as a whole as well as individually.
Counterpicking (picking heroes your opponent wants)
Counterpicking as mentioned before is a requirement to decent drafting but how is it done? you may ask. Easy pick heroes that own your enemies, either in lane in general whatever.
Example 1: Magnus will have no fun soloing mid vs viper, because viper can harass magnus very well being ranged and the orb also hinders magnus' movement and attack (this is amplified by the fact that he is melee which makes is near to impossible for him to avoid the orb when laning.)
Example 2: A spectre will have no fun vs NA, because nerubian assassins ganking ability really limits spectres freedom to farm.
Counter picking can be game breaking and should be used as often as possible, If you can see that a few of your opponents heroes share an achilles heel then a counterpick is a must.
Picking what your opponent wants requires either luck or experience. By that i mean you'll either guess what your opponent wants to pick and snatch it up first or you'll figure it out by reading their past picks. It isn't always necessary or even usefull but in the situation that you can obtain a hero that your opponent would need to complete their lineup whilst still keeping a strong lineup, you will have put your opponent at a disadvantage before the game has even begun.
An example of this in practice would be picking ogre magi if your opponents have already picked silencer. Silencers buffed by magi late game is no laughing matter, but if you manage to pick ogre the Silencer will have a harder job dealing as much damage as he could with the ogres buff.
LINK TO PAGE:
i recomend you read this, its all important.http://forums.dota-allstars.com/index.php?showtopic=229454
Drafting (past+present)
Drafting in 6.48b differs hugely from drafting now in 6.52e not only has the amount of bans changed, but also popular picks have changed and high tier heroes have changed. I will outline what are now (in my opinion) high tier and above heroes of 6.52e. (they aren't in any order for the moment)
Low tier heroes can still be used but are generally seen to be a weak pick in comparison to other heroes, these heroes generally have spells of little use to a team. For example bloodseeker is a weak pick as his ulti is easy to nullify, strygwyrs thirst is easily countered if you simply keep an eye on your hp etc.
Mid to high tier heroes is a really massive pool in this version, many old high tier heroes have moved down (Sandking, Leshrac etc.) and many new heroes have been discovered or rediscovered i should say such as Broodmother, juggernaut. Generally speaking they require a specific lineup/lane to be effective, if they are picked in correct situations they can be unstoppable.
High tier heroes are heroes that are generally thought to be "imba" or better than most other heroes, these are heroes that can normally adapt to a variety of different strategies/lineups and are regularly banned. Which brings me to my next subject.
Banning
Banning heroes is fairly simple and straight forward task. When you ban heroes, you want to have at least a rough idea of heroes you want picking in your mind and counters to them. You also want to stop the opponents from getting as many high tier heroes as possible.
This means that when you're sentinel (or first-picking) you want to ban a lot of high tier heroes ideally stopping your opponents from picking highest tier heroes on their 1st two picks, this can be achieved by simply banning high tier heroes OR if it is obvious from the bans what kind of strat your opponents are going for, ban heroes that are fundamental for the lineup they desire.
For example, if your opponents ban several gankers/strong early game heroes lets say Chen, BM, NA it may become clear that they are after a jungling hero that is strong late game. So you could ban Terrorblade. (Note: there is always a likely chance that it could simply be a coincidence that they are banning these heroes, but Terrorblade is a high tier hero anyway so its a win win situation if they are going for a strat revolving around him/strong late game hero.
When you're banning for scourge (or picking second), its generally a good idea to leave 3 top tier heroes unbanned, this way you're guaranteed to get 2 decent heroes which not only puts you at an advantage, but puts the opposing team at a disadvantage and gives them a smaller scope of heroes to work with.
For example, if the current bans are -wl, -na, -bm, -lich, -tb, -zeus, -qop I'd recommend banning a decent hero but not a top tier hero/a hero that you don't want to be first or second picking (e.g Magnus) this means that if the enemy pick say PotM, you are still left with puck es (or whatever heroes you're after).
Banning for specific lineups/heroes
Specific lineups are countered in a variety of ways generally speaking.
1. Gank > carry (Early/mid)
2. Push > carry (Early/mid)
3. Carry > all (Late)
Other than the above, generally it's specific heroes that counter strats/other groups of heroes. Here are two examples:
Example 1:
Pugna's Nether Ward - Wards > nukes. This should be taken account when banning/picking.
Example 2:
If you're aiming to jungle with TB, BM is a 100% must to ban, Chen also due to his overwhelming force early game . Hence, banning for Junglers - BM/Chen > TB. This is easy when it comes to high tier heroes, you can ban a high tier hero that would counter your strategy without revealing your desired heroes.
So what do you do when it is a lower tier hero that counters your lineup/hero. Say for whatever reason you want to go for Lich, Lesh, Lina, etc. the obvious counter to these is Pugna, but Pugna isn't really a ban-worthy hero. So my advice is this: Under these circumstances, I would either leave the hero unbanned in which case you have to pick subtlely, or ban the hero on your last pick this means the enemy have no bans (or only 1) to react to this ban in either case you should be safe and be allowed to at least pick the majority of your desired heroes.
Picking
The picking part of drafting in my eyes is a tad more complex. Not only are there more heroes involved, but reading your opponents picks is essential as counter picking is vital to a good draft, its easier to loose track of picks and mess things up.
Although the fundamentals of picking are pretty easy to grasp, when picking you need to maintain a balance of counter-picking and picking heroes you desire. If you can do this and work them into a lineup then you're well on your way to being OK at drafting, its quite hard for me to actually convey how this is done without using some drafts as examples so i will take the drafts from my next few clan wars and post them here with annotations.
When picking your first 1 or 2 heroes (if you're second picking) be sure that you have a mental note of the full ban list or even better have someone who isn't drafting write them down as you go along if you let the opposition have too many heroes they want by forgetting the bans you're screwed. If you have no specific lineup in mind it goes a little something like this for your three turns of picking:
When picking first:
Turn 1: 1st - god tier heroes
Turn 2: 2nd/3rd - mid/high tier heroes
Turn 3: 4th/5th - whatever makes lanes from your current heroes/create synergies.
When picking second:
Turn 1: 1st/2nd - god tier/high tier
Turn 2: 3rd/4th - Mid/high, Lanes/Synergies
Turn 3: 5th - Lanes/Synergies
When picking a specific lineup you must include at least some high tier heroes or else the opposing team will get too many high/god tier heroes then you may aswell ff. But generally it goes something like this.
Don't forget when picking that even high tier heroes are circumstantial and you can end up with a crappy lineup with a few high tiers, make sure that your heroes also work as a whole as well as individually.
Counterpicking (picking heroes your opponent wants)
Counterpicking as mentioned before is a requirement to decent drafting but how is it done? you may ask. Easy pick heroes that own your enemies, either in lane in general whatever.
Example 1: Magnus will have no fun soloing mid vs viper, because viper can harass magnus very well being ranged and the orb also hinders magnus' movement and attack (this is amplified by the fact that he is melee which makes is near to impossible for him to avoid the orb when laning.)
Example 2: A spectre will have no fun vs NA, because nerubian assassins ganking ability really limits spectres freedom to farm.
Counter picking can be game breaking and should be used as often as possible, If you can see that a few of your opponents heroes share an achilles heel then a counterpick is a must.
Picking what your opponent wants requires either luck or experience. By that i mean you'll either guess what your opponent wants to pick and snatch it up first or you'll figure it out by reading their past picks. It isn't always necessary or even usefull but in the situation that you can obtain a hero that your opponent would need to complete their lineup whilst still keeping a strong lineup, you will have put your opponent at a disadvantage before the game has even begun.
An example of this in practice would be picking ogre magi if your opponents have already picked silencer. Silencers buffed by magi late game is no laughing matter, but if you manage to pick ogre the Silencer will have a harder job dealing as much damage as he could with the ogres buff.
LINK TO PAGE:
i recomend you read this, its all important.http://forums.dota-allstars.com/index.php?showtopic=229454
ket- Posts : 56
Join date : 2008-09-22
Re: DRAFTING!!!! nb stuff plz read kae :>
Shew that was a lot of good reading, thanks. My mind is now hurting im gonna go pop a pain killer
Nibbles- NwB Member
- Posts : 38
Join date : 2008-09-22
Age : 41
Location : PE
Re: DRAFTING!!!! nb stuff plz read kae :>
taaa, i gained some knowledges :>
lol nibz, u regular u
im soo tired i havnt slept properly in like 4 days, my brain is numb from all this reading
lol nibz, u regular u
im soo tired i havnt slept properly in like 4 days, my brain is numb from all this reading
Re: DRAFTING!!!! nb stuff plz read kae :>
Cnt help it, told u i liked the furum = my new home page
Nibbles- NwB Member
- Posts : 38
Join date : 2008-09-22
Age : 41
Location : PE
Re: DRAFTING!!!! nb stuff plz read kae :>
My homepage is google. Nothing can beat google. Google is God. Google is Google. etc
Re: DRAFTING!!!! nb stuff plz read kae :>
Gen i think you dragged a troll with you from war3 lol :>
ket- Posts : 56
Join date : 2008-09-22
Re: DRAFTING!!!! nb stuff plz read kae :>
Interesting read...
Guess we are going to need much more experience to be able to guess their next hero picks in order to snatch or counter them.
I think we should play an AR game once in a while so everyone can learn to play more heroes. I (for one) am very limited...
Guess we are going to need much more experience to be able to guess their next hero picks in order to snatch or counter them.
I think we should play an AR game once in a while so everyone can learn to play more heroes. I (for one) am very limited...
NiteKitti- NwB Member
- Posts : 56
Join date : 2008-09-22
Age : 35
Location : On the moon
Re: DRAFTING!!!! nb stuff plz read kae :>
Best way to do it? Play more -sd and -ar. don't swap out your hero, ask someone if your not sure about the skills, builds, and strats etc.
theres so much more to drafting than whats in that guide anyway, its pretty much a basic summary. If you go look at picks and elims from recent International games, guys are playing weird heroes.
Play more friendly clannies, as many as you can.
theres so much more to drafting than whats in that guide anyway, its pretty much a basic summary. If you go look at picks and elims from recent International games, guys are playing weird heroes.
Play more friendly clannies, as many as you can.
ket- Posts : 56
Join date : 2008-09-22
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